Psychopath and Narcissist Survivors Support Group

Riccy101 · Joined: 18 Feb 2007 Posts: 287

Hi Thay.

My parents were exactly the same. Whenever something threatened their world of omnipotent control, their response was always to project their dark deeds on the accuser. Or is that mirroring? Any way, they were NEVER wrong, or at fault. Never. They're what they are, I'm afraid. They'll never change.

You know... your parents missed out on a relationship with an absolute wonderful son. Their disorder will never allow them to see the truth, but that doesn't change it. You're a very personable, giving, kind and gentle person to this board. You have a lot to offer to the world. I'm afraid trying to love your parents will only be wasted on them. But there are a lot of nice and good people out there who would love to have your friendship.

Riccy

sheenie2000 · Joined: 16 Feb 2007 Posts: 169 Location: North Carolina

i'm still grieving over the loss of a mother's love. have u guys battled with depression? i feel like that never goes away? i was on st john's wort and then i was feeling better so i start to think i dont need it anymore but then it hits me again. will this be like this for the rest of my life? will i just need medication forever (even if it's an herbal med) ?
_________________
"Happiness is not an accident. Nor is it something you wish for. Happiness is something you design." - Jim Rohn

thayilflies · Joined: 16 Feb 2007 Posts: 488

Thankyou Riccy.

Riccy101 · Joined: 18 Feb 2007 Posts: 287

Hi Sheenie.

I know that feeling very well. I believe when I first began detaching from my parents, I was actually grieving. Sometimes I still think about things and I feel sad. Those times are getting less frequent. It always helps me to remind myself what she'd be doing to me if I decided to have contact again.

Our parents have a personality disorder that render them unable to love. That's a fact. Nothing we can do will ever change that. All we can do is learn to move on. If you need a shoulder, Sheenie, you know I'm always here.

Riccy

kikisand · Joined: 21 Feb 2007 Posts: 67

The wonderful doctor who helps me with this issue every once in a while when I need her (she is a therapist - but is sooo busy with multiple other things) has said that all of us need to go through a grieving period in order to get through to the other side where we can truly be detached from the situation. She knows because she went through it herself - she says she used to send her kids off to school, draw the blinds, grab a pillow and just cry, cry, cry at what she had never had. Now, I am amazed, but she can have visits and talk to her Mom and Dad without feeling the "feelings" - which we all know what those are.

Hope that helps
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God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change; courage to change the things I can; and wisdom to know the difference.

sheenie2000 · Joined: 16 Feb 2007 Posts: 169 Location: North Carolina

Thanks for your advice Riccy and Kiki. I really appreciate it.

I have been taking St John's Wort again and it's helping a lot. It makes such a difference in my mood.

Yea I think I just have to cry about it when I get upset about it.

I wonder if I'll have to take St John's wort forever or what. I guess I'll see what happens. At least it's herbal and not really any side effects except some nasty bad breath every once in awhile. (Which more affects my husband lol)
_________________
"Happiness is not an accident. Nor is it something you wish for. Happiness is something you design." - Jim Rohn

wlw35 · Joined: 09 Mar 2007 Posts: 367

Yes, my NM is probably going about town telling everyone "oh, it's that post-partum depression..." she hasn't been the same, thank God for the depression, I've finally seen the light, best thing that's ever happened to me! It's always someone else's fault. She actually told me, I hope they don't "medicate" you. This is when I knew it was time to start detaching and the fact that I cried hysterically after our conversations.

Riccy101 · Joined: 18 Feb 2007 Posts: 287

wlw35, yup...they're toxic and they're poisoning you. Time to get away from them if you want to save your own life.

Trying to live with an N is like committing a slow form of suicide.

Riccy

wlw35 · Joined: 09 Mar 2007 Posts: 367

I just re-read your posts from the beginning, my depression is getting worse, my MD went up on the zoloft and it's actually worse, I don't understand. I had a brief time when things were good, so just wanted to get that out. Anyway, I go today to discuss more options. As for the grieving, I'm still "stuck" there. I see grandparents holding their children, swinging them around, smiling, in that moment tears begin to fall, you are so right, I will never have that, I just wanted more for my children, is that so wrong? Still waiting to reach the otherside of freedom and I know this is just a necessary painful process, it just doesn't make it any easier. Thanks for listening. Just having a rough week.

Riccy101 · Joined: 18 Feb 2007 Posts: 287

Big Hugs to you, wlw35.

The final stage of grieving is acceptance. You'll get there eventually. Look at it this way, there's nothing you can do to change it so acceptance is the only thing that will give you peace of mind and spirit. Crying and depression is only a temporary reaction that really doesn't solve anything...if you can put it in that context. Crying helped when we were infants and couldn't communicate that we were hungry. It made our parents tend to us...

There's always something else out there waiting to brighten your world. Take heart. It will come. You have lots of support here in this group. That's one bright spot already.

Riccy Smile

seekingserenity · Joined: 14 Mar 2007 Posts: 179

Riccy,

You wrote:

"My mother never liked me. She frightened the bejeezers out of me. She ruled with an iron hand and sharp tongue. There was no sweetness or light from that woman. I tried to walk the straight and narrow line so I didn't anger her and risk feeling her wrath. My NF paid little attention to his family, including my mother until she went off on the warpath with him, or he needed her to dote on him like she was his mother!"

Wow. This is so much like my parents. Both N. My mother worse (I think) than father. She was nasty, mean, harsh and arrogant. My father also paid little attention to his family. Still doesn't.

My parents divorced in 1985. NC is easier for me with my father because he, for the most part, doesn't want to talk to me or my husband and kids.

As for my Nmother -- you've all seen my recent posts about her phone calls. She combines the guilt with the "sweet," which really isn't sweet at all from her. And using my daughter's birthday to try to get contact. Mostly Nmom does a lot of guilt trips.

It's hard having both parents N. And my siblings -- no support there. Last night I had a dream that I was at an Alanon meeting with my sister -- she was in recovery and she understood. Then I woke up. I want so badly the validation that would come from a family member or a sibling about how crazy my two Nparents are. But I don't think that is going to happen. It feels sad and alone -- like I've got this "secret" about myself that I can't tell because the world won't understand. So I just walk around with this weird secret about my messed up family of origin. Getting tired and rambling.

Take care all,

Serenity

wownowfree · Joined: 17 Feb 2007 Posts: 256

Riccy & Serenity

I have the same scenario with my parents. My father was a big N, but couldn't control my mother, so he made himself scarce. Never home.

Nmom ruled the roost. Did everything for herself. Went to night school my whole childhood. Big cerebral N. Left us kids alone a lot. Busy studying when she was home. Never had any time for us.

This is my parents exactly. Funny thing, it was easy to go No Contact with Dad, but N mom just won't go away.

I identify with Serenity that we just have to go thru life without expecting other people to understand. Unless you grew up with it, it is hard to explain.

I liked what Riccy said about: Our parents have a personality disorder that render them unable to love. That's a fact. Nothing we can do will ever change that. All we can do is learn to move on. Excellent words to live by.

To wlw and others who suffer with depression, hang on, things will get better. They're not worth a moment of distress for us.

I'm still in the greiving process, but strong enough that I will never go back.

wownowfree

wlw35 · Joined: 09 Mar 2007 Posts: 367

Wowfree, you've summed it up nicely, it's so important for me to have support where others really understand, all of my friends have pretty good families, ones who at least babysit or act like good parents. I'm at the acceptance point with the personality disorder, can't change them, have to change myself. My NF was completely uninvolved in our lives, it's been easy to go NC, I never really formed an attachment to him, it really bothers my NM. NM smothered us, kept us dependent, became less tolerant of our own opinions during the horrid teenage years. She's been VERY quiet, no calls, she never did call, I was also the one, the one giving and giving, no more! I partly put myself out there for my kids, that was my reasoning and felt she seemed excited about the kids, at least my daughter, but once the boys arrived, she became more distant, more N.
The last conversation, she talked about how bad the nursing homes are, that people don't care, etc... I'm an RN and feel she wants me to take care of her! Can't do it, things will get more complicated as they age.
The depression, well, it's partly due to them letting me down, I gave them a second chance, heart and soul, so the fall really hurt, the other part, genetics possibly, my NPs are ACOAs, I also have suicide in my family. I've fought depression for years without medication, now it's not a choice, it's absolutely necessary for the time being, getting stronger by the day. One thing is for sure, I cannot go back for me, physically or mentally.

wownowfree · Joined: 17 Feb 2007 Posts: 256

wlw,

Sounds like your mother is trying to manipulate you to feel bad and take care of her. Don't feel bad. Was she there to take care of you when you were a child and needed her? What about your family? Should you neglect your own children to take care of her? Like you, I thought my mother would help me with my children, especially since her divorce and she was alone. Was I wrong! Instead, she blamed me for her life, was jealous of me, and I had to take care of her needs even though I had 2 babies just a year apart.

I suffered depression in my early 20's, so I know a bit about that deamon. Don't feel bad about anti-depressants. Do whatever you need to do to combat that debilitating disease. You are not alone, millions of people suffer depression and take medicine for it. There is nothing to be ashamed of. In fact, you should pat yourself on the back for taking care of yourself and getting help.

I think you are strong and will get thru this. Don't let Nmom get you down.

wownowfree

wlw35 · Joined: 09 Mar 2007 Posts: 367

You know the answers to the questions, my NM was there for me, but not consistently, especially in my teens, she wouldn't even take me to the dr. one time when I had a raging strep infection which caused a kidney infection, I had to rely on a cheating old boyfriend to take me. My family forced me into bad relationships as I acted a an N, to get where I needed to go, I took advantage, but also looked for attention from males, due to absent father. Never good enough, smart enough, etc.. Of course, the guilt arises and "honor thy father and mother" comes up, now I know God will forgive me due to these circumstances, I have an answer for the years of woes and it's not going to get better if I don't get out of the relationship. Have to take care of myself and family and form healthy relationships. I plan on commmenting in PL's post about friendships, yes the world looks very N to me! Do you guys think this a generational deal? My NPs are in their 60's, I've also read that genetics do play a role and then of course the environment (nuture v. nature). What are your thoughts??? WLW