Psychopath and Narcissist Survivors Support Group

IdontThinkIamCrazy · Joined: 04 May 2008 Posts: 48

Is it normal for a N to make you out to look like the bad one to his family and his friends? Making you look crazy? My N cheated on me and didn't hide it to well, when i found out, i got very upset and very angry, he then spun it out to make it look like me.

silverchick · Joined: 16 Apr 2008 Posts: 3

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Cookie2 · Joined: 28 Feb 2007 Posts: 1403

YES! Its what THEY do........Welcome to the group.....
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I have a photographic memory....I just don't have same day service.....................Cookie

samvaknin · Site Admin Joined: 15 Feb 2007 Posts: 2316

Projection

We all have an image of how we "should be". Freud called it the "Ego Ideal". But sometimes we experience emotions and drives or have personal qualities which don't sit well with this idealized construct. Projection is when we attribute to others these unacceptable, discomfiting, and ill-fitting feelings and traits that we possess. This way we disown these discordant features and secure the right to criticize and chastise others for having or displaying them. When entire collectives (nations, groups, organizations, firms) project, Freud calls it the Narcissism of Small Differences.

Projective Identification

Projection is unconscious. People are rarely aware that they are projecting onto others their own ego-dystonic and unpleasant characteristics and feelings. But, sometimes, the projected content is retained in the subject's awareness. This creates a conflict. On the one hand, the patient cannot admit that the emotions, traits, reactions, and behaviors that he so condemns in others are really his. On the other hand, he can't help but being self-aware. He fails to erase from his consciousness the painful realization that he is merely projecting.

So, instead of denying it, the subject explains unpleasant emotions and unacceptable conduct as reactions to the recipient's behavior. "She made me do it!" is the battle cry of projective identification.

We all have expectations regarding the world and its denizens. Some people expect to be loved and appreciated - others to be feared and abused. The latter behave obnoxiously and thus force their nearest and dearest to hate, fear, and "abuse" them. Thus vindicated, their expectations fulfilled, they calm down. The world is rendered once more familiar by making other people behave the way they expect them to. "I knew you would cheat on me! It was clear I couldn't trust you!".

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/personalitydisorders21.html

Abusers regularly deny the abuse ever took place – or rationalize their abusive behaviors. Denial is an integral part of the abuser's ability to "look at himself/herself in the mirror".

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/abuse4.html

The narcissist projects this "civil war" and drags everyone around him into a swirl of bitterness, suspiciousness, meanness, aggression and pettiness. His life is a reflection of his psychological landscape: barren, paranoiac, tormented, guilt ridden. He feels compelled to do unto others what he inflicts upon himself. He gradually transforms his closest, nearest and dearest into replicas of his conflictive, punishing personality structure.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/faq21.html

In the narcissist's surrealistic world, even language is pathologized. It mutates into a weapon of self-defence, a verbal
fortification, a medium without a message, replacing words with duplicitous and ambiguous vocables.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/journal34.html

The narcissist invades our personality. He makes us react the way he would have liked to, had he dared, or had he known how (a mechanism known as "projective identification"). We are exhausted by his eccentricity, by his extravagance, by his grandiosity, by his constant entitlement.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/faq42.html

The narcissist feels omnipresent, all-pervasive, the prime mover and shaker, the cause of all things. Hence his constant projection of his own traits, fears, behaviour patterns, beliefs, and plans onto others.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/narcissistubiquity.html

We feel threatened not by the Other with whom we have little in common – but by the "nearly-we", who mirror and reflect us.

The "nearly-he" imperils the narcissist's selfhood and challenges his uniqueness, perfection, and superiority – the fundaments of the narcissist's sense of self-worth. It provokes in him primitive narcissistic defences and leads him to adopt desperate measures to protect, preserve, and restore his balance. I call it the Gulliver Array of Defence Mechanisms.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/journal87.html

The narcissist's lifestyle, his reactions, in short: his disorder, prevent the development of a mature love, of real sharing, of empathy. The narcissist's mate, spouse, or partner is treated as an object. She is the subject of projections, projective identifications and a source of adulation.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/faq79.html

All abusers present with rigid and infantile (primitive) defense mechanisms: splitting, projection, Projective Identification, denial, intellectualization, and narcissism. But some abusers go further and decompensate by resorting to self-delusion. Unable to face the dismal failures that they are, they partially withdraws from reality.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/abuse14.html

Narcissists have emotions, very strong ones, so terrifyingly overpowering and negative that they hide them, repress, block and transmute them. They employ a myriad of defence mechanisms to cope with their repressed emotions: projective identification, splitting, projection, intellectualisation, rationalisation.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/faq80.html

The inverted narcissist (IN) is a narcissist who "projects" his narcissism onto another narcissist. The mechanism of projective identification allows the IN to experience his own narcissism vicariously, through the agency of a classic narcissist. But the IN is no less a narcissist than the classical one. He is no less socially reclusive.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/faq67.html

Being the target of relentless, ubiquitous, and unjust persecution proves to the paranoid narcissist how important and feared he is. Being hounded by the mighty and the privileged validates his pivotal role in the scheme of things. Only vital, weighty, crucial, essential principals are thus bullied and intimidated, followed and harassed, stalked and intruded upon - goes his unconscious inner dialog. The narcissist consistently baits authority figures into punishing him and thus into upholding his delusional self-image as worthy of their attention. This provocative behaviour is called Projective Identification.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/journal60.html

What is unusual about the narcissist's sadistic behaviours - premeditated acts of tormenting others while enjoying their anguished reactions - is that they are goal orientated. "Pure" sadists have no goal in mind except the pursuit of pleasure - pain as an art form (remember the Marquis de Sade?). The narcissist, on the other hand, haunts and hunts his victims for a reason - he wants them to reflect his inner state. It is all part of a mechanism called "Projective Identification".

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/journal33.html

Narcissism is regarded by many scholars to be an adaptative strategy ("healthy narcissism"). It is considered pathological in the clinical sense only when it becomes a rigid personality structure replete with a series of primitive defence mechanisms (such as splitting, projection, Projective Identification, intellectualization) – and when it leads to dysfunctions in one or more areas of life.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/journal63.html

Transference (and counter-transference) are quite common on the Net and the narcissist's defence mechanisms – notably projection and Projective Identification – are frequently aroused. The therapeutic process is set in motion by the – unbridled, uncensored, and brutally honest - reactions to the narcissist's repertory of antics, pretensions, delusions, and fantasies.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/journal67.html

The compulsive giver is an artist of projective identification. He manipulates his closest into behaving exactly the way he expects them to. He keeps lying to them and telling them that the act of giving is the only reward he seeks. All the while he secretly yearns for reciprocity.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/journal96.html

Psychopaths regard other people as objects to be manipulated and instruments of gratification and utility. They have no discernible conscience, are devoid of empathy and find it difficult to perceive other people's nonverbal cues, needs, emotions, and preferences. Consequently, the psychopath rejects other people's rights and his commensurate obligations. He is impulsive, reckless, irresponsible and unable to postpone gratification. He often rationalises his behaviour showing an utter absence of remorse for hurting or defrauding others.

Their (primitive) defence mechanisms include splitting (they view the world – and people in it – as "all good" or "all evil"), projection (attribute their own shortcomings unto others) and Projective Identification (force others to behave the way they expect them to).

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/abusefamily20.html

psychopaths feel no remorse when they hurt or defraud others. They don't possess even the most rudimentary conscience. They rationalize their (often criminal) behavior and intellectualize it. Psychopaths fall prey to their own primitive defense mechanisms (such as narcissism, splitting, and projection). The psychopath firmly believes that the world is a hostile, merciless place, prone to the survival of the fittest and that people are either "all good" or "all evil". The psychopath projects his own vulnerabilities, weaknesses, and shortcomings unto others and force them to behave the way he expects them to (this defense mechanism is known as "projective identification"). Like narcissists, psychopaths are abusively exploitative and incapable of true love or intimacy.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/personalitydisorders16.html

http://samvak.tripod.com/abuse18.html

The pedophile makes frequent (though unconscious) use of projection and projective identification in his relationships with children. He makes his victims treat him the way he views himself - or attributes to them traits and behaviors that are truly his.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/pedophilia.html

The narcissist then "envies" his self. He seeks to destroy and devalue his own self. He seeks to punish himself and to motivate others to punish him ("projective identification").

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/faq69.html

The narcissistic parent seems to employ a myriad primitive defences in his dealings with his children:

Splitting – Idealising the child and devaluing him in cycles, which reflect the internal dynamics of the parent rather than anything the child does.

Projective Identification – Forcing the child to behave in a way which vindicates the parent's fears regarding himself or herself, his or her self-image and his or her self-worth. This is a particularly powerful and pernicious mechanism. If the narcissist parent fears his own deficiencies ("defects"), vulnerability, perceived weaknesses, susceptibility, gullibility, or emotions – he is likely to force the child to "feel" these rejected and (to him) repulsive emotions, to behave in ways strongly abhorred by the parent, to exhibit character traits the parent strongly rejects in himself.

Projection - The child, in a way, becomes the "trash bin" of the parents' inhibitions, fears, self-loathing, self-contempt, perceived lack of self-worth, sense of inadequacy, rejected traits, repressed emotions, failures and emotional reticence.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/faq66.html

They cast themselves in the role of victims and attribute mental disorders to others ("pathologizing"). They employ the primitive defence mechanisms of splitting and projection augmented by the more sophisticated mechanism of projective identification.

In other words:

They "split off" from their personality the bad feelings of hating and being hated – because they cannot cope with negative emotions. They project these unto others ("He hates me, I don't hate anyone", "I am a good soul, but he is a psychopath", "He is stalking me, I just want to stay away from him", "He is a con-artist, I am the innocent victim").

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/faq82.html

Narcissists adopt all kinds of defences to counter narcissistic shame. They develop addictive, reckless, or impulsive behaviours. They deny, withdraw, rage, or engage in the compulsive pursuit of some kind of (unattainable, of course) perfection. They display haughtiness and exhibitionism and so on. All these defences are primitive and involve splitting, projection, projective identification, and intellectualization.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/faq01.html

Terrorists seek omnipotence through murder, control (not least self control) through violence, prestige, fame and celebrity by defying figures of authorities, challenging them, and humbling them. Unbeknownst to them, they seek self punishment. They are at heart suicidal. They aim to cast themselves as victims by forcing others to punish them. This is called "projective identification". They attribute evil and corruption to their enemies and foes. These forms of paranoia are called projection and splitting. These are all primitive, infantile, and often persecutory, defense mechanisms.

Continue to read this article here (click on this link):

http://samvak.tripod.com/12.html

http://samvak.tripod.master.com/texis/master/search/mysite.html?q=Projective+Identification

http://samvak.tripod.master.com/texis/master/search/mysite.html?q=Projection

mthankful · Joined: 01 Apr 2007 Posts: 84

mikey#1 · Site Admin Joined: 27 Mar 2007 Posts: 566

Like everyone else has said " Oh, yes". Even tired to convince police that he was defending himself from me (he is six foot, me 5 foot 2 inches) and I was the one with all the bruises. They laughed and arrested him. I know I was lucky because sometimes it does not happen that way.

Whenever he was abusive (verbal, emotional or physical) it was always my fault and I deserved it. Very sad and hard to comprehend. I finally realized that all that matter is what my grown sons thought. Dropped anybody as friends that doubted my story. True friends and loyal family should know the truth.

They will do anything to continue the lie of who they pretend to be. I was very fortune, no children involved and was not married to him. I could walk away and dust my hands off. Of course it has taken me a long time (almost 2 years since he left) to heal and get to where I am today.

mikey

mthankful · Joined: 01 Apr 2007 Posts: 84

Oh Mikey, you hit in on the nose. Their lies are incredible, bold and sometimes illogical. And of course, some of them learn their craft really well. My exN did. And as you have observed - they will do anything it takes to conceal what they really are. For me this was particularly hard, especially when I felt the court/justice system failed both my son and I.

I have done the same as you - I made new friends and left the ones that didn't understand, those that I found nonsupportive, or too insensitive. I went through hell for the past three years, and I too, have concluded that what really matters to me are my kids. I tell you dealing with it all - then cleaning out the closet of all those you thought were friends is a handful in itself.

The lies are just the beginning of the truly disgusting nature of their sickness. Once you start to understand how they think (see what they are) - that is the real sickening part.
m

samvaknin · Site Admin Joined: 15 Feb 2007 Posts: 2316

Very common. Read these:

Projection and Projective Identification - Abuser in Denial

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/narcissisticabuse/message/5002

Guilt? What guilt?

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/narcissisticabuse/message/4931

Stella Sleepwalks · Joined: 11 May 2008 Posts: 6

My ex didn't cheat on me, but he was verball abusive and controlling. He made out to my own mother that I was this evil, vindictive, nasty person, (a projection of his own crazed traits), luckily my mother stood up to him and said "I know my daughter better than she knows herself, and you don't deserve her! Never set foot on my property again!"

He could be incredibly insensitive at times and whenever I stood up to him he would turn it around on me. Change the subject almost, tell me that I was hurting HIM and then I would end up apologising! He could turn on the tears at the flickof a switch!

mynewpath1122 · Joined: 16 Jun 2008 Posts: 1

The most abusive way I have been treated by my narcissistic boyfriend was by being accused of being selfish, whenever I did not cater to him when he expected to be catered to or whenever I asked him to do something for me that he did with contempt or did in such a way that it was obviously done badly on purpose, (to get me to not ask anything of him anymore) and when I dared to complain about his behavior, he angrily accused me of being selfish, storm out of the room and stop talking to me. My being called selfish is so ridiculous, because if I was any less selfish I would morph into his ego.
thankfully, I've reached a point of no longer getting hurt by his angry "rejection" of me and I now see it for what it is, which is just a manipulative game on his part to get me to cater to him and make me feel like its never worth asking him to do anything for me, to get control over me and deny me my rights in the relationship. It is amazing how he can do one thing for me, like fix my car battery, (ranting with rage the whole time he's doing it) and believe he is the one giving in the relationship, when the amount of things I do makes his changing my car battery insignificant. But that's what narcissists do, they take anything they do for you and see it as justification to call you selfish when you don't act as their slave.

k8edidski · Joined: 08 Jul 2008 Posts: 1

My ex has turned my son against me, won't allow him to see me and calls me crazy. I sent my son to him with straight A's a little over a year ago and a nationally ranked tennis player.

Now my son hates me, is flunking out and no longer plays tennis. A judge is thinking it over but time is fleeting.

Amazing the destruction and no remorse or care. Very hard to understand.

browneyedgirl443 · Joined: 19 Jun 2008 Posts: 23

My ex N lifted me up by both hands around my neck one night after an arguement and held me there, then threw me across his driveway. Why?
Because I would not give him his keys when he asked me, as I was trying to keep him there long enough to talk over our relationship. He never even raised his voice at me, he just said, " D, Give me my keys." I said, not till you talk to me about why you all of a sudden shut yourself away from me and won't take my calls. He said," D, I am gonna ask you one more time." I walked in closer to him and started to repeat myself and well...CHOKESLAM. Shocked

As I laid sprawled out on the asphalt, I threw his keys in his dark yard and said.." find em." He calmly grabbed his flashlight from his truck while I laid there hurting and in disbelief and searched for them. When he found them and started into the house, my adrenaline kicked in and I followed, MAJOR PEED OFF. I cussed like a sailor, called him every foul thing I could and said you wanna fight, lets go, that is when mr tough guy, called the cops on me. ON ME Shocked

Yep, I would say that got turned around for sure. I got an escort out of there, my stuff thrown out, and he told all his drunken buddies that I was crazy. Then he would text me that if I called or texted him (cause I did wanting my things as I was too upset to take them that night) that I was stalking him and he had a restaining order on me. Oh and he would also tell them that I was sleeping around on him, when all I ever did was ride my horse or go out to dinner with my father or visit with my family...GAH, they are insane! Mad

survivor23 · Joined: 29 Jul 2008 Posts: 50

OMG... This stuff is textbook N.

This is all Ns have.... btw.. All they know how to do is twist the truth, so you look like some crazy demon, and they are saints and gods, just trying to help you.

This is the pinnacle of how they operate.

psychedupenough · Joined: 08 Sep 2008 Posts: 6

i am new here as of today....these posts were a real trigger for me.....the narcissistic psychopath i'm marrie to worked like a little beaver to make me out the bad guy......he once tried to smother me and break my arm in the driveway....during what they said was a mini psychotic break, most likely brought on by washing down his psych meds with hot vodka.....i told him i wanted him to leave....and he went crazy....i fought with him for nearly an hour inside the house.......as he tried to smother me to death on the bed......slashed my face with a wallpaper knife......and slammed me into walls.....i fought back......he has a lower partial plate that is attached with caps.....and i had my hand in his mouth.....tugging as hard as i could......fighting hm off.......i finally broke free.....and made it as far a the driveway.....where he tackled me.....he sat his 240 pounds on top of my 110 pounds.....twisting my left arm behind my back.....and grinding my face into the gravel......finally a neighbor heard my screams and came running.....when he yelled at the psycho, he jumped off me and ran back into the house.....by the time the police came.....the psycho had managed to pull himself so together that he strolled outside and convinced the police that i had attacked HIM......even with my neighbor standing there saying otherwise.....i had to beg the cops to go inside and get my purse....so he wouldn't steal my credit cards and checkbook.......he sauntered into the police station and filled out a five page false police report...in which he claimed that the house was in his name only (mine only)...that the business was his alone (total lie)....that i was an alcoholic and a drug user (he is)....that i contstanly abused him (ha)...that i had attacked him.....on and on and on and on........just lied with impunity.....and was totally believed......after that, i never again trusted the police.....ever.......i eventually persuaded a detective to run the psycho......and his little stint in a federal pen for selling cocaine came out....i was released.....it never ceases to amaze me what he gets away with.......and i too have heard over and over and over.......'you make me behave this way'.......'you're trying to make me the bad guy'......'you're setting me up'.....i hate his guts...........

moonlightkisu · Joined: 16 Sep 2008 Posts: 126 Location: USA

absolutely.

My N probably made me look like the 'crazy' one to his parents (whom I met, and the mother saw her son as could do no wrong.)

Later on, he told people many lies as projection:

- that I was a whore (i'm a virgin)
- that I cheated on him with some guy at a club (I never cheated once, nor have I ever been to any club)
- that I didn't love him, I was trying to use him (no, that was him too, I loved him very much)
- that I wasn't a good girlfriend and didnt have good manners (nope, I wa always polite, he was the poor boyfriend.)

They transubutate the good into the bad, theie failures into the successes, and so this way, they ensure they never fail. But they always do.
_________________
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you were a million miles away
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