Psychopath and Narcissist Survivors Support Group

mutlover

My brother was diagnosed at 3 weeks with a heart defect and given a month or so to live. (this was 55 yrs ago) Nothing they could do. I know this was devasting for my mom and can't imagine what it was like to live with the baby each day knowing he was going to die but..... He lived a few more weeks and died at 6 weeks old.

There are no photos of this baby and none were ever taken. Why would you not take photos of your baby if you knew it was going to die? I should add that my mom took few photos of us growing up either - but there are boxes of her taken by her mom. (smothered w/attention I think).

Not too long ago, she showed me a page from a magazine and said, look at this - it looks like _____ (the baby that died) He was the prettiest baby of all of you (isn't that a sweet NM thing to say?)

I know everyone reacts to things differently but.....

mommybunny1 · Joined: 15 Feb 2007 Posts: 266 Location: Middle Atlantic

I am sorry about your brother. However, 55 years ago, it wouold have been unusual to have taken a picture of a dying baby. It was thought best to let them go and be forgotten into the past. We have learned now that this is the wrong way to handle it. Beliefes were different in many communities back then.

Sad, isn't it?
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Mommybunny

eyeswideopen · Joined: 16 Feb 2007 Posts: 212

That is sad. I am sorry about your brother as well.

sheenie2000 · Joined: 16 Feb 2007 Posts: 169 Location: North Carolina

maybe at the time, people were so saddened by what happened that they couldn't take pictures. i think when someone has an unhealthy baby, they get into a deep depression themselves and dont have energy to do something positive or fun.

also maybe it was a way of just trying to forget what happened, it was their way of moving on by having no memories of it.

now we'd probly want something to hold on to and cherish it.
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"Happiness is not an accident. Nor is it something you wish for. Happiness is something you design." - Jim Rohn

thayilflies · Joined: 16 Feb 2007 Posts: 486

NF dominates the family photographs. He definately loves to pose for the camera: ignorant fool. Rolling Eyes

Aquarius1972 · Guest

I can't be sure about the say 1950 but in the 19th century it was very normal to make a picture of the mother PLUS the deceased baby! So that they had something to remember, and get this: the child on the picture is already dead!

So I have to say about that your family not taking pictures of your brother could very much be about not seeing the neccessity. Just because it is so painful you want to take pictures so that later if you want to you can look at them. And also what about other later born children? Didn't they have they right to see their deceased brother which they never knew?

Aquarius1972 · Guest

I can't be sure about the say 1950 but in the 19th century it was very normal to make a picture of the mother PLUS the deceased baby! So that they had something to remember, and get this: the child on the picture is already dead!

So I have to say about that your family not taking pictures of your brother could very much be about not seeing the neccessity. Just because it is so painful you want to take pictures so that later if you want to you can look at them. And also what about other later born children? Didn't they have they right to see their deceased brother which they never knew?

Aquarius1972 · Guest

I can't be sure about the say 1950 but in the 19th century it was very normal to make a picture of the mother PLUS the deceased baby! So that they had something to remember, and get this: the child on the picture is already dead!

So I have to say about that your family not taking pictures of your brother could very much be about not seeing the neccessity. Just because it is so painful you want to take pictures so that later if you want to you can look at them. And also what about other later born children? Didn't they have they right to see their deceased brother which they never knew?

mutlover · Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 1:43 am Post subject:

Aquarius,

Thanks - My parents and grandparents are from a mountainous, secluded area in US. Women and babies routinely died during childbirth there into the 1950s. Because it was so secluded with few roads and little medical care, I suppose the region was at that time 10-20 yrs behind the rest of the US. Anyway - I can't tell you how many photos I have seen/been shown of the dead mother and baby together - in the casket.

I'm just not sure about it - and everytime I have asked her why there aren't any photos - it is like poking the bear with a stick. So....

My brother and I are all that are left besides crazy NM and we both are bothered by and would love to see photos of our brother.

Thanks....

Riccy101 · Joined: 18 Feb 2007 Posts: 287

Did your mother ever give your brother a name? What was his name?

Riccy

mutlover · Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2007 12:48 am Post subject:

Yes - they named him - he lived 6 weeks. I'm not sure of the timing but I think he was probably a couple of weeks old at least when the trouble began and probably took a week or so to diagnose. (Did you know that life insurance companies won't insure babies until they are 15 days old? We have had a few babies die in my family from congenitial heart defects and this is how I learned this. Evidently the mother's antibodies stay in the baby's body for 14 days and so day 15 is when problems start emerging. This is what happened with two other babies in my family and the doctors told us this.

I wasn't being harsh about NM on this matter - just trying to put it all together and figure out about this. Call me paranoid but I'd rather not give his name but it is a very common name.

StainedClassKing · Guest

femfree · Site Admin Joined: 11 Feb 2007 Posts: 667

HI mutlover. After 59 years of living I've learned one thing. Never judge a person around the time of serious illnesses and death. We all react differently.

Anyone can do the paradigm shift of thinking. "I won't have this child long and I must take pictures to remember how precious s/he is." or, "This is the most horrible time of my life, I could not deal with having reminders around that would remind me of this tragedy."

I would think that a parent who makes either decision needs only compassionate understanding for their decisions.

I guess that old Indian saying about walk a mile in someone else's shoes....
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Nothing is easier than to denounce the evildoer;
nothing is more difficult than to understand him.
Fyodor Dostoevsky

mutlover · Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 10:33 pm Post subject:

FEMFREE,

THANKS FOR YOUR INPUT, WHY IS IT THAT WHEN I SEE YOU HAVE RESPONDED TO MY POSTS, I BRACE MYSELF FOR A SCOLDING OF SORTS?

I WAS CURIOUS ABOUT PEOPLE'S THOUGHTS ABOUT THIS AND RECEIVED A COUPLE OF INTERESTING COMMENTS.

NOTHING YOU STATED WAS ANYTHING THAT I DIDN'T ALREADY KNOW OR WASN'T COMMON SENSE... A PERIOD OF LOSS IS A BAD TIME TO MAKE A JUDGEMENT ABOUT ANYONE - I KNOW THAT AND YOU WOULD BE HARD PRESSED TO FIND ANYONE MORE UNDERSTANDING THAN I AM ABOUT THAT. AS FOR THE OLD INDIAN SAYING.... WHAT MAKES YOU THINK I HAVEN'T WALKED A MILE. I LOST A PREGNANCY/BABY AT FIVE MONTHS ....

ALL OF WHAT YOU SAID APPLIES IF YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT A REASONABLY WELL BALANCED PERSON. I POSTED THIS QUESTION ON THIS FORUM BECAUSE IT IS ABOUT DISORDERED PEOPLE/PARENTS.

I COULD UNDERSTAND NEARLY ANY BEHAVIOR FROM A GRIEVING PARENT AND NOT QUESTION OR PASS JUDGEMENT ABOUT THEIR ACTIONS. PERHAPS YOU ARE CORRECT AND WE SHOULD EXCUSE MY MOTHER'S BEHAVIOR AT THAT TIME.

PERHAPS THAT WOULD BE POSSIBLE IF I DIDN'T HAVE 50 YEARS OF EMOTIONAL ABUSE TO IN THE BACKGROUND - I FIND IT HARD OR AT THE VERY LEAST TRYING WHEN DEALING WITH THESE DISORDERED PEOPLE TO DISTINGUISH LEGITIMATE ACTIONS FROM MANIPULATIVE, DESTRUCTIVE ONES AND RIGHTLY SO.

ODDLY, MY M USES MY DECEASED BROTHER AS A FORM OF ABUSE LIKE EVERYTHING ELSE- HOW MANY TIMES HAVE I HEARD - YOUR BROTHER WAS THE MOST BEAUTIFUL BABY OF ALL FOUR OF YOU. SHE COLLECTS DRAWINGS IN MAGAZINE OF WHAT SHE THOUGHT HE LOOKED LIKE AS A BABY. OF COURSE HE LOOKS LIKE A GERBER BABY AND WILL SHOW IT TO ME AND SAY - THIS LOOKS JUST LIKE YOUR BABY BROTHER - HE WAS THE MOST BEAUTIFUL BABY OF ALL FOUR OF YOU. I WOULD NEVER IN A MILLION YEARS EVER SAY THIS TO EITHER OF MY CHILDREN.

MY M HAS BOXES OF PHOTOS OF HERSELF (WHEN SHE WAS YOUNG AND BEAUTIFUL) AND VERY FEW IF ANY OF HER CHILDREN. PERHPAS THAT IS THE REAL PROBLEM. AGAIN, NOT SOMETHING TO INDICT SOMEONE ON IF THEY ARE A REASONABLY SANE PERSON. AND TAKEN AS A PART OF THE WHOLE...............

wlw35 · Joined: 09 Mar 2007 Posts: 367

My NM has poster-sized black/white photos of her at aged 8-9 up in the guest room, she talks about the day they were taken, like it was yesterday. There are NO family photos hanging in the house of my sister, myself, or NF, eventhough she has them in photo albumns. Feels good, I'm not alone.