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Postby samvaknin » Fri Apr 24, 2009 3:52 pm

I am still with my partner (I will not call him N because I am not sure if he is one – therefore my question below). We have been married for almost 17years. We had an arranged marriage; his mother's persistence. He worked in his parents business since he left school and has no formal qualifications. Does not have a driver’s license – feels he does not need one. He has always said “what am I doing with him; when I could have anyone”. Generally he feels I am good looking, have my degree, a good job. We have 2 children – boys 12 and 7. The younger diagnosed with learning difficulties and has a statement of need (earlier diagnosis autism). I have worked since 16years and always did teaching when the boys were younger. In our earlier years of marriage he was always going out with this friends and he would leave me at home on my own. He would organise events for him and his friends – never with me and the children. He played football and golf and went on trips with his friends – never with me and the children. He has got an angry temperament. He has said “I will always be in your(my) shadow.”Â

 he has said "if i knew that married life and having kids was going to be like this...then i would have chosen something else". to this i was gobsmacked, upset. a lot of people may feel this way but they get on with life and try to enjoy it. saying to to the one he loves is a smack in the face. i told him "choose what you want now...i will not be second best."Â

Financially he had got into debt once – which I cleared because he said “my debt is your debt”….”when we get the money in from the sale of the business…then it will be OUR money…” after 4 years I have not seen any. his logic about savings and money is weird. he is willing to use eg all the childrens money on buying a bigger house and increasing the house loan; not saving for their education. whereas he will buy himself clothes, workout shopping list finances to a penny. the larger context is not there.

he has no friends. he had 2 cousins who he was very close to and he has avoided them and not been in touch with them because "other things matter and and more important."

he will not go on social events with me. i will go alone with the children. he feels he does not gain anything from going, no point going. he does not feel he needs other people. his relationship with this mother was constant nagging on her part when he worked in the family business. he feels his mum has always critisised him.

he feels women are the superior sex. that we give birth and have the mother earth role. men cause a lot of crime and if women ruled the world would be a better place! he has said this.

When I packed his bags 2 months ago and left outside and locked the door. He cried and sobbed about how he needed the kids and me to heal. He has admitted he feels very low and very sad that he was controlling and that he was arrogant and selfish with his time… He went to his mums but was more concerned about what his mother was told. He was so frightened about what explanation I had given her. I told her the truth - that he had hit me (slapped and punched me). This was not the first time. He was at his mums for 4 nights. He came back and wanted to stay and said he will be a lot calmer, not angry and no swearing.Â

The first incident of physical abuse was when I have been out with my sister and he waited up and then tried to pull my trousers down say “I bet you have shaved your legs…” (basically shaved my legs because I was on the pull).Â

The second was when he slapped me on the car park of the shopping centre in front of the children (4 years ago). i could not find him and my older son whilst shopping because I took the younger one to the toilet and we got late getting back to where they were waiting for us. We met them back at the car park and he went mad. He slapped me hard and shouted at me whilst people watched. He kept shouting. I don’t event know now what he was saying. He shouted at me all the way home with tears streaming.Â

Another incident when he pushed me in the corner of the kitchen and then threw keys at me which bruised and cut my leg.

The incidents are not recurrent regular but these have been over the past 10 years.

I have mostly paid for the house, groceries, taxes, home furnishings. He is now paying when ready to do so. When his contract come to an end he will not be able to pay. He is talented with home DIY and completed the house. He will do anything to have a fully furnished clean house. He tidies my underwear draw. When told not to he thought I was implying that I need privacy and those are my belonginging and that in a marriage he saw it as having no private areas. He did it again. he will spend all day doing it and leaving the kids downstairs to do their own thing. He has never taken them out. I cant remember him ever kicking the ball around with them or taking them to the park or for a walk or to the local shop. He will go himself. He works now in a factory with people who barely speak any English and he feels superior. I said to him once. Its as if you enjoy your job so much I thought it was a stepping stone. He went mad at me saying “I get on with it. It is a means to get money and that is it. I don’t complain like you (me) do about work.Â

On his days off he would be on the computer all day looking at houses and cars. Eventually he nagged me to get his car. He could not get one because he has no licence. The car is now under my name and so is the insurance.Â

He will not put the kids to bed, read them a story or help with their homework. He will not ask how there day has been. He will not initiate conversation with them. He will not go to their parents days to school. He will not go to any concerts. He said once when I asked him to come with him “I will if otherwise it will cause friction”. When asked to come to the park after a “no – I don’t want to” to “ok otherwise I will be made to feel….”. when asked why he does spend the time; said “its overrated”.

He said he loves his children. I believe he does in a way. But he said he is a worrier and that he worries about our safety.  It’s a weird sort of worry. Not about school and how his children are getting on. But about eg getting run over in the street.

He has always loved sex and introduced group sex. He has called me frigid. Checked my period dates and said “I (he) cant believe that I am the only women who has her period every 2 weeks!”. He wanted sex on the night of my father's funeral. Did not really care about my feelings. He has tried to force sex and when heard me crying, has stopped. He masturbates a lot and he watches porn. he wants me to watch it with him. i dont like it. he tries to get me in the mood. but i dont like it. for quite a while we did role playing - he wanted to. it seemed we had to role play all the time when having sex. he wanted to and would help me get in the mood. i would be a slut and he would blackmail me else would tell my husband! i eventually put an end to them. he still wants to do them knowing i dont like it. he wanted a 3 some - which i agreed to eventually. stupid me wanted to make him happy. he was so upset after and i was critizised for not doing it properly. nothing happened because he put an end to it. why did he get so upset and suicidal for days after and then want to do it again! he sat in the dark and drank and drank and he would not eat and he was like a stray and lost the will. he has said when coming from a night out "i have rejected so many women for you..and come home to be rejected by you." once he said when we were out "the women behind me just said...she come just looking at me (him)".Â

I had hit rock bottom, very depressed and feeling very lost in life and just craved for normality (still do). I tried to tell him but there is no understanding. He said “I (me) choose to feel like this”.Â

Latest incident he got very upset that I did not choose to watch a film with him (upstairs) and instead choose to watch one with the children (downstairs). His lectures and headaches. “cant a husband want to spend time with his wife…what’s wrong with this..when A (eldest son) grows up and leave then what…” I feel he is jealous of the time I spend with them. He has said “I wish someone had helped me when I was young …like B is being helped.” (B my younger son).

 He has put me in situations to make a decision …which will be the wrong one regardless.Â

 He will try to talk late evening and have a few drinks before he starts. He will not let me sleep. Said sleep is over rated. When you die you will sleep.

I believe he is projecting a lot of him onto me. i sort of understand this. i thought i was going mad. i am scared that i am sort of turning into him. thinking the world is not all that! there is a better place! oh my god just writing these words are scaring me. he would say the same thing - that he was not like this when he was younger. he has not had a relationship before me. he feels he needs to control me in desperation of abandonment. but it does not explain the selfish attitude he as with the children.Â

birthdays he does not like celebrating. for years he did not want to and then - "you dont celebrate mine...it would be nice for my birthday to be acknowledged." i remember once on my birthday he said (giving me a card)..."you're not going to cry because i didn't get you a cake". 2 years ago he said (coming back after a meal) "thankyou for letting me take you out!" we had booked our first family holiday 4 years ago, my dad had past away, but we decided to still go for the children and to get away. He was terrible for the 2weeks. shouting at me and the older one. he was horrible.  i said that my dad had died recently and i needed some support...he made out that i wasn't giving him any support.


when i am ill...he is ill.Â

when i had a miscarriage he sent his sister in law to see me and could not close the family shop 1hr early. i called the doctor and had to deal with the discharge on my own. my older son with me - then 2 years. then told me a few weeks later "i need to get over it"

i know he is but it seems that if i spend anytime with my sisters out or go to my mums he will look at the time. whereas i can go for 3/4 days with the kids to my sisters and he will not really care. last year i went out (after years of thinking what he will be like if i went out) with my sisters for a meal. during the day he was ill, would not come and watch a film with the kids and me. when we got back i wanted to make an early tea and get ready. he was now out of bed and said (looking at the dinner) "is that what i'm getting" (his manner and tone was 'is that it' ). he was not happy. he waited up. the next day he told me to write the shopping list (i do every week). i had not written it yet and after 10 minutes or so he said "i'm not asking you write the roman treaty!" just like when he says things like "its not rocket science!" once he whistled at me from the top of the stairs like you whistle with a dog. he laughed it off. He pushed open the bathroom door when i was having a bath because he wanted something from the cupboard and shouted at me whilst i was in the bath about why i have to keep the bathroom door closed.

 when our first son was very young he had very little to do with him. he still doesn't do anything with him. my son has talked to me about it and to his cousins. when i spoke to my husband about it i am told i am critizising. when i packed his things and he went to his mums - the children did not ask about him. the older one wanted to see him and i felt that he thought he could get dads attention (or something). my children are happy. he said this "they are happy and that's all credit to you (me)".Â

my dad was a N - he made my mums life hell. he made our life hell! i know what i didn't want and this was not how he was at the beginning.Â

 i spent the 1st year of married life travelling and lived at my sisters for 4 nights in the week and travelled back on the weekend. once i went on training and he could not get hold of me and was very upset - thinking i was cheating on him! he is very possessive. i am his soul mate. he is jealous and accused me of cheating. not constantly but i know he has not trusted me for most part of our marriage. i dont think he still trusts me now. apparently "what is trust...just overrated". He has given me a detailed account of what i did with one of his male relatives when we all went out. once when we went out on new years eve - it was very busy and we went to the toilets and as far as i remember the first to come out the toilets has always waited for the other outside. the pub was busy the toilets were upstairs. i came out and waited. waited. must have been a good 5-10 minustes. i went downstairs and in the crowd he was there having his drink. i asked him why he didn't wait and he said whats the problem! to this day, i still feel confused and an idiot for accepting his stupid response. once he left my underwear on the bed (underwear i had not even taken with me to an overnight training trip). then accused me of taking my red underwear.Â

once he sorted my underwear draw and i asked him not to do it again that these draws have my private things. he has held it against me saying that he "cant believe that a wife would say this is out of bounds to her husband and that it is her private space". basically we have to share everything (which we do anyway) since we have no boundaries! when i try to develop i get these obscurd responses forever after. recently he did it again. in afact, he sorted all my wardrope out. i even said thankyou to him! this is what he did in the day when the kids were downstairs - he avoids them i think!

i used to cry for feeling sad and down. i did not know why i was feeling so down. i now know that what we have is not normal and it is a sort of "play/act" relationship. i hate it being like this. so whay cant i change it. i have tried all these years.Â

he wanted to do property development. when asked how long will you plan to get the house done...he said very seriously "it takes as long as it takes..." my idea of property development is different. when we bought this new house 3 years ago - it was the final point when i thought it may make a difference in his life - something he has always wanted to do. i have to take the mortage on. he would not have been able to buy the house /contents without me. his dad invested in the first house; but he claims that was owed to him and now i get him saying "who lives in a 350k house...i dont see you sisters living in a house like this...i paid into it aswell..." i am financially tied now. i cant get another mortage.

 timing logic is weird and he has to do everything according to his mindset. we dont matter. he would never go out his routine. i stopped asking. initially i could not understand why i was feeling low. everytime there would be something which i knew i could not say to him because i knew it would cause a problem. then the having to think and word things carefully got draining and kept eating away at my happy side. i have always been told i was the happy one...always smiling, engaging and good with the children and i think i was young and very niave and only 16 when i first met him. then 18 and got married at 20. he is 5.5 years older than me.Â

 from going out several nights a week and leaving me in to watch TV for years...he has now changed to wanting to spend all his time with me, the internet (when i'm here or not). he could spend all day moving the house furniture around to see what looks best to the point when i am asked what looks best! he constantly would do this for days! when he cleans the house - he is not a nice person. we have to either leave the house or move around the rooms to avoid him".Â

when nice he is full of compliments and always says how nice i look and can be a nice person. does his share of the housework (not kids though). but as i said the housework can become torturous. if it were just him and me he would have my time and i think would be happy. he does love the children but is more of a long distance father (has presents for birthdays and christmas).Â

he believes i am abusing him and controlling him! he now says this. he says that my silent treatment with him is a slap in the face...far worse than the slap he gave me. the slience is on my part because i am sick and tired of the "why dont you love me...what is so revolting about me...do i have leapors (sorry lost spelling will now!) or something...one day i will die and then you will realise...what is it...come on...what have i done that is so terrible....there are peadophiles out there...murderers...i cant be that bad...why are you sitting like this now... (mimics my posture and face expression)...ec etc etc. i was getting ill. headaches for days..so i need space and time. but then when i have time i forget the true reason for the arguments - and think what are we doing...and i forget the reason for the argument because there really was no reason! you see!

does the above demonstrate abuse and/or living with an N 9or someone with N traits)Â -Â i read that abuse was constantly belittering and controlling?

am i sill being naive and should wake up and smell the coffee?

is he jealous of the kids?

has he N traits which can be teated ?

he was outgoing first and now has become anti social (always had high sex drive). if he is an N do they change depending on their environment?
Last edited by samvaknin on Mon May 11, 2009 12:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby samvaknin » Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:36 pm

Regarding your first question:

Violence in the family often follows other forms of more subtle and long-term abuse: verbal, emotional, psychological sexual, or financial.

It is closely correlated with alcoholism, drug consumption, intimate-partner homicide, teen pregnancy, infant and child mortality, spontaneous abortion, reckless behaviours, suicide, and the onset of mental health disorders.

Most abusers and batterers are males – but a significant minority are women. This being a "Women's Issue", the problem was swept under the carpet for generations and only recently has it come to public awareness. Yet, even today, society – for instance, through the court and the mental health systems – largely ignores domestic violence and abuse in the family. This induces feelings of shame and guilt in the victims and "legitimizes" the role of the abuser.

Violence in the family is mostly spousal – one spouse beating, raping, or otherwise physically harming and torturing the other. But children are also and often victims – either directly, or indirectly. Other vulnerable familial groups include the elderly and the disabled.

Abuse and violence cross geographical and cultural boundaries and social and economic strata. It is common among the rich and the poor, the well-educated and the less so, the young and the middle-aged, city dwellers and rural folk. It is a universal phenomenon.

Abusers exploit, lie, insult, demean, ignore (the "silent treatment"), manipulate, and control.

There are many ways to abuse. To love too much is to abuse. It is tantamount to treating someone as an extension, an object, or an instrument of gratification. To be over-protective, not to respect privacy, to be brutally honest, with a sadistic sense of humour, or consistently tactless – is to abuse.

To expect too much, to denigrate, to ignore – are all modes of abuse. There is physical abuse, verbal abuse, psychological abuse, sexual abuse. The list is long. Most abusers abuse surreptitiously. They are "stealth abusers". You have to actually live with one in order to witness the abuse.

There are four important categories of abuse:

Click HERE for A Classification of Abusive Behaviors

I. Overt Abuse

The open and explicit abuse of another person. Threatening, coercing, beating, lying, berating, demeaning, chastising, insulting, humiliating, exploiting, ignoring ("silent treatment"), devaluing, unceremoniously discarding, verbal abuse, physical abuse and sexual abuse are all forms of overt abuse.

II. Covert or Controlling Abuse

Abuse is almost entirely about control. It is often a primitive and immature reaction to life circumstances in which the abuser (usually in his childhood) was rendered helpless. It is about re-exerting one's identity, re-establishing predictability, mastering the environment – human and physical.

The bulk of abusive behaviors can be traced to this panicky reaction to the remote potential for loss of control. Many abusers are hypochondriacs (and difficult patients) because they are afraid to lose control over their body, its looks and its proper functioning. They are obsessive-compulsive in an effort to subdue their physical habitat and render it foreseeable. They stalk people and harass them as a means of "being in touch" – another form of control.

To the abuser, nothing exists outside himself. Meaningful others are extensions, internal, assimilated, objects – not external ones. Thus, losing control over a significant other – is equivalent to losing control of a limb, or of one's brain. It is terrifying.

Independent or disobedient people evoke in the abuser the realization that something is wrong with his worldview, that he is not the centre of the world or its cause and that he cannot control what, to him, are internal representations.

To the abuser, losing control means going insane. Because other people are mere elements in the abuser's mind – being unable to manipulate them literally means losing it (his mind). Imagine, if you suddenly were to find out that you cannot manipulate your memories or control your thoughts... Nightmarish!

In his frantic efforts to maintain control or re-assert it, the abuser resorts to a myriad of fiendishly inventive stratagems and mechanisms. Here is a partial list:

Unpredictability and Uncertainty (Intermittent Reinforcement)

The abuser acts unpredictably, capriciously, inconsistently and irrationally. This serves to render others dependent upon the next twist and turn of the abuser, his next inexplicable whim, upon his next outburst, denial, or smile.

The abuser makes sure that HE is the only reliable element in the lives of his nearest and dearest – by shattering the rest of their world through his seemingly insane behaviour. He perpetuates his stable presence in their lives – by destabilizing their own.


Refuse to accept such behaviour. Demand reasonably predictable and rational actions and reactions. Insist on respect for your boundaries, predilections, preferences, and priorities.

Disproportional Reactions

One of the favourite tools of manipulation in the abuser's arsenal is the disproportionality of his reactions. He reacts with supreme rage to the slightest slight. Or, he would punish severely for what he perceives to be an offence against him, no matter how minor. Or, he would throw a temper tantrum over any discord or disagreement, however gently and considerately expressed. Or, he would act inordinately attentive, charming and tempting (even over-sexed, if need be).

This ever-shifting code of conduct and the unusually harsh and arbitrarily applied penalties are premeditated. The victims are kept in the dark. Neediness and dependence on the source of "justice" meted and judgment passed – on the abuser – are thus guaranteed.


Demand a just and proportional treatment. Reject or ignore unjust and capricious behaviour.

If you are up to the inevitable confrontation, react in kind. Let him taste some of his own medicine.

Dehumanization and Objectification (Abuse)

People have a need to believe in the empathic skills and basic good-heartedness of others. By dehumanizing and objectifying people – the abuser attacks the very foundations of human interaction. This is the "alien" aspect of abusers – they may be excellent imitations of fully formed adults but they are emotionally absent and immature.

Abuse is so horrid, so repulsive, so phantasmagoric – that people recoil in terror. It is then, with their defences absolutely down, that they are the most susceptible and vulnerable to the abuser's control. Physical, psychological, verbal and sexual abuse are all forms of dehumanization and objectification.


Never show your abuser that you are afraid of him. Do not negotiate with bullies. They are insatiable. Do not succumb to blackmail.

If things get rough – disengage, involve law enforcement officers, friends and colleagues, or threaten him (legally).

Do not keep your abuse a secret. Secrecy is the abuser's weapon.

Never give him a second chance. React with your full arsenal to the first transgression.

Abuse of Information

From the first moments of an encounter with another person, the abuser is on the prowl. He collects information. The more he knows about his potential victim – the better able he is to coerce, manipulate, charm, extort or convert it "to the cause". The abuser does not hesitate to misuse the information he gleaned, regardless of its intimate nature or the circumstances in which he obtained it. This is a powerful tool in his armory.


Be guarded. Don't be too forthcoming in a first or casual meeting. Gather intelligence.

Be yourself. Don't misrepresent your wishes, boundaries, preferences, priorities, and red lines.

Do not behave inconsistently. Do not go back on your word. Be firm and resolute.

Impossible Situations

The abuser engineers impossible, dangerous, unpredictable, unprecedented, or highly specific situations in which he is sorely needed. The abuser makes sure that his knowledge, his skills, his connections, or his traits are the only ones applicable and the most useful in the situations that he, himself, wrought. The abuser generates his own indispensability.


Stay away from such quagmires. Scrutinize every offer and suggestion, no matter how innocuous.

Prepare backup plans. Keep others informed of your whereabouts and appraised of your situation.

Be vigilant and doubting. Do not be gullible and suggestible. Better safe than sorry.

III. Control and Abuse by Proxy

If all else fails, the abuser recruits friends, colleagues, mates, family members, the authorities, institutions, neighbours, the media, teachers – in short, third parties – to do his bidding. He uses them to cajole, coerce, threaten, stalk, offer, retreat, tempt, convince, harass, communicate and otherwise manipulate his target. He controls these unaware instruments exactly as he plans to control his ultimate prey. He employs the same mechanisms and devices. And he dumps his props unceremoniously when the job is done.

Another form of control by proxy is to engineer situations in which abuse is inflicted upon another person. Such carefully crafted scenarios of embarrassment and humiliation provoke social sanctions (condemnation, opprobrium, or even physical punishment) against the victim. Society, or a social group become the instruments of the abuser.


Often the abuser's proxies are unaware of their role. Expose him. Inform them. Demonstrate to them how they are being abused, misused, and plain used by the abuser.

Trap your abuser. Treat him as he treats you. Involve others. Bring it into the open. Nothing like sunshine to disinfest abuse.

IV. Ambient Abuse and Gaslighting

The fostering, propagation and enhancement of an atmosphere of fear, intimidation, instability, unpredictability and irritation. There are no acts of traceable explicit abuse, nor any manipulative settings of control. Yet, the irksome feeling remains, a disagreeable foreboding, a premonition, a bad omen. This is sometimes called "gaslighting".

In the long term, such an environment erodes the victim's sense of self-worth and self-esteem. Self-confidence is shaken badly. Often, the victim adopts a paranoid or schizoid stance and thus renders himself or herself exposed even more to criticism and judgment. The roles are thus reversed: the victim is considered mentally deranged and the abuser – the suffering soul.


Run! Get away! Ambient abuse often develops to overt and violent abuse.

You don't owe anyone an explanation - but you owe yourself a life. Bail out.

For A Classification of Abusive Behaviors - click on this link:


Is he a Narcissistic Abuser? He is an abuser, no doubt.

Only a qualified mental health diagnostician can determine whether someone suffers from Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) and this, following lengthy tests and personal interviews.

These may be of help - click on the links:

For a more detailed view of pathological narcissism and the Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) - click on these links:



http://malignantselflove.tripod.com/per ... ers13.html

http://malignantselflove.tripod.com/per ... ers14.html

http://malignantselflove.tripod.com/nar ... lance.html


Other Personality Disorders


Pathological Narcissism diagnosed with Other Mental Health Disorders


NPD (Narcissistic Personality Disorder) and AsPD (Antisocial Personality Disorder, Psychopathy, or Sociopathy)

http://malignantselflove.tripod.com/per ... ers16.html

http://malignantselflove.tripod.com/per ... ers15.html

How to Recognize a Narcissist Before It is Too Late?

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/na ... ssage/4976
Encyclopedia of Narcissism and Psychopathy:


Buy 16 books or 3 video DVDs about narcissists, psychopaths, and abusive relationships - click on this link:

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Postby samvaknin » Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:37 pm

Regarding your second question:

Yes, you are and yes, you should.

These may be of help - click on the links:

Rescue Fantasies - Surviving the Narcissist


The Malignant Optimism of the Abused


The Inverted Narcissist - Codependence and Relationships with Abusive


Codependence and the Dependent Personality Disorder


The Dependent Patient - A Case Study


Danse Macabre - Trauma bonding and the Stockholm Syndrome


The Cult of the Narcissist


The Narcissist's Victims


Victim Reactions to Abuse by Narcissists and Psychopaths


Mourning the Narcissist


The Three Forms of Closure


Back to La-la Land


The Spouse/Mate/Partner of the Narcissist


Divorcing the Narcissist and the Narcissistic Psychopath - How Do I Get Rid of Him?


Traumas as Social Interactions


How Victims are Affected by Abuse


How Victims are Affected by Abuse - Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD)


How Victims are Affected by Abuse - Recovery and Healing


Narcissists and Personality disordered Mates, Spouses, and Partners

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/na ... ssage/5013

Projection and Projective Identification - Abuser in Denial

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/na ... ssage/5002

Approach-Avoidance Repetition Complex and Fear of Intimacy

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/na ... ssage/5000

Guilt? What guilt?

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/na ... ssage/4931

Narcissists, psychopaths, sex, and marital fidelity

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/na ... ssage/4920

The Narcissist or Psychopath Hates your Independence and Personal Autonomy

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/na ... ssage/4959

I miss him so much - I want him back!

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/na ... ssage/4934

Take care.

Encyclopedia of Narcissism and Psychopathy:


Buy 16 books or 3 video DVDs about narcissists, psychopaths, and abusive relationships - click on this link:

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Postby samvaknin » Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:43 pm

Narcissists have a complicated relationship with their children. Yes, they are often jealous of their own offspring. Read this, a narcissist's view of children:

"Children, to me, are both mirrors and competitors. They reflect authentically my constant need for adulation and attention. Their grandiose fantasies of omnipotence and omniscience are crass caricatures of my internal world. The way they abuse others and mistreat them hits close to home. Their innocuous charm, their endless curiosity, their fount of energy, their sulking, nagging, boasting, bragging, lying, and manipulating are mutations of my own behaviour. I recognize my thwarted self in them. When they make their entrance, all attention is diverted. Their fantasies endear them to their listeners. Their vainglorious swagger often causes smiles. Their trite stupidities are invariably treated as pearls of wisdom. Their nagging is yielded to, their threats provoke to action, their needs accommodated urgently. I stand aside, an abandoned centre of attention, the dormant eye of an intellectual storm, all but ignored and neglected. I watch the child with envy, with rage, with wrath. I hate its effortless ability to defeat me."

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Narcissistic and Psychopathic Parents and Their Children

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Postby samvaknin » Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:55 pm

Some narcissists become schizoids (averse to social interactions).

See these:


Some narcissists are not gregarious. They avoid social events and are stay-at-home recluses. Doesn't this behaviour go against the grain of narcissism?


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Schizoids are loners. Given the option, they invariably pursue solitary activities or hobbies. Inevitably, they prefer mechanical or abstract tasks and jobs that require such skills. Many computer hackers, crackers, and programmers are schizoids, for instance - as are some mathematicians and theoretical physicists. Schizoids are inflexible in their reactions to changing life circumstances and developments - both adverse and opportune. Faced with stress they may disintegrate, decompensate, and experience brief psychotic episodes or a depressive illness.

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Encyclopedia of Narcissism and Psychopathy:


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