Psychopath and Narcissist Survivors Support Group

wownowfree · Joined: 17 Feb 2007 Posts: 267

I read this sentence on "CAn you REcognise a Narcissist" website:

the narcissist processes social information in terms of its relevance to the self, that is, he reacts to negative feedback with more anger and aggression and lower self-esteem than a non-narcissist.

The narcissist processes all Social Incoming Data in terms of its relevance to the Self. Anything that is not relevant to the self (like the feelings of others) is NOT relevant to them. Even if the other person is experiencing something in relation to the words or actions of an N - it is not relevant to them. It's YOUR problem not theirs. So there is no way to approach an N with their behavior and its effects on you.

How, then, can you approach or "get through" to an N. The only way is in relevance to to the N's self. Now that incoming data (from you) can be positive or negative. If it's positive the N wants more of it. If it's percieved as negative, how does the N react? With narcissistic rage. Defensive narcissistic walls come up and the tables are quickly turned on the bearer of bad news like a machine gun. What if the negative data is coming from a loved one very close to the N? A spouse? A child? Doesn't matter. They must be cut down to protect the ego.

So we can't communicate our feelings to them because they have no empathy. Even if the incident didn't involve them, they don't relate at all. For example: "I lost my job today." "My teacher failed me." "My boyfriend broke up with me." How does the N react? They don't react at all. It's not relevant to the Self. Oh, they may be good at pretending to act human, but those closest to them quickly learn that it's all an act.

I think this is the most frustrating part of this whole disorder. I still have trouble accepting this. I sometimes fool myself that some day I will get through to the N.

baby_kay · Joined: 05 Mar 2008 Posts: 217

I agree, it is so frustrating. When I think back to hundreds of times, when I for one minute thought, and prayed that Nm could get something? All the wasted emotions that went into the conversations, the trying to explain, the thinking that this person, could someday wake up and get it? Its too bad. I like the informatin you posted, as it is helpful to remind all of us, of this seemingly unfair situation. It is unfair. It is downright horrific.
Peace
Kim

Serenity710 · Joined: 12 Jul 2007 Posts: 84

Thank you Wownowfree for this post. It really summarizes, very well, why I cannot talk to the Ns in my family. It is horrific Kim! And so true. It is so difficult for us to understand -- for it ever really to sink in -- just how twisted they are. This is why it's almost impossible to explain it to others. And this is why we need reminders of how they really operate. To protect ourselves from the abuse that comes our way when the information about self is negative, or when it doesn't concern them, and they just blow us off, don't respond, start talking about themselves, or in my Nmom's case, she grunts when it's not about her.

I've been away from the forum for a while, and then the first post that I read is so good. Thank you!

Serenity

baby_kay · Joined: 05 Mar 2008 Posts: 217

Serenity,
I like you post also. What goes around comes back around. Especially for the N of the world. I am glad we have a place we can come and talk about this so that we can keep our sanity. Especially for those who have to deal with the N. I do not anymore. Boy, is it quite. Its nice to know that when things happen its not someone (The N) reeking havoc in my life. I have a son who I think is N to a degree. Its sad. it hurts. But nothing I can do, but keep as much distance as I can. He is grown, but it sad how this disease is passed down. I guess......thank to all for the continued support.
Kim

thayilflies · Joined: 16 Feb 2007 Posts: 501

You might as well try relating to a tree-shrew as a narcissist. It is a fruitless endeavour. Trying to "get through" to someone who is absent in pointless, you are better off detaching. Sometimes it helps to view everything as "my problem" (which it is, of course). Instead of posing the question "why does she/he not love me or see me?", ask yourself "why I do need to feel loved by this person (or that person)?"

Why seek external validation when all the validation you require is within? It is inner love, love of self that needs cultivation.

justmee · Joined: 15 Feb 2007 Posts: 692

Thay....

Do you think when we can find the valedation within, then maybe the anxiety will subside?

just thinking,
justmee
_________________
If you can not deal with it, or change it, then its time to walk away from it.

lynn1234 · Joined: 14 Aug 2007 Posts: 722

Wownowfree...
You are right you can't get through to an N and they filter everythig through their own Needs or wants...

My NM used to ask me questions about my work when I wasn't NC .. Geez.. I thought for awhile that she actually cared about my day and my life.. Nope.. she was just trying to guage how much I was working so she can decide how much money she could ask me for... Rolling Eyes

Just about everything seemed to have an alternative motive with her which equalled her self-gratification... It had nothing to do with me... I have never met anyone else like her in my life except for relating to the stories on this forum...
Anyway... I was so unimportant to my NM that she wouldn't want to waste her valuable time talking on the phone with me unless ofcorse she needed something. Instead my NM would screen her calls on her answering machine figuering out who was relevant to that days need and only then pick up the phone.. If I wasn't needed for some want of hers then she would disapear for a month or two at at time only to resurface to get some need met...In the mean time I would be left worrying about her if she was dead or alive or not feeling well or what???? She could care less that her daughter was thinking about her or concerned.....Totally a one sided relationship.. She makes me feel objectified and like a tool instead of a human being and a daughter...
Anyway.. I can relate to the " N's relevance to self" stuff that you are talking about.... There's the examples I have mentioned above...

baby_kay · Joined: 05 Mar 2008 Posts: 217

lynn1234
I totally get your post regarding your mother only communicating when she needed you for something. My sister did that to me all the time. The latest, or last, was in Nov. it was her 40 birthday. I did all the preparations for the party. I made all the food, I took it to the place she had it. I got there 2 hours before everyone else. Decorated, the whole 9 yards. It was nice time, but I did all of this with a abseste tooth. The next day I was overtaken with extreme pain. Went to dentist, had another root canel, the worst one ever. I was down and out for 4 days. Pain, pain killers, swollen, it was at the bottom of my nasel cavity so my headaches, felt like I was gonna die. My sister was too busy to be bothered with me. I finally talked to her 2 weeks later and she was annoyed to hear from me. She was with her friend, (who did not have to do anything for the big party) and when I addressed her state of annoyance with me, she blew a gasket, blew me off, and turned around when I had enough to NC again.....Said this to me, "Sorry you just can't have a relationship with me". Like I DID something. I cried for days, and days. I was sooooo hurt. But for like the millionth time, she did it to me again. I went NC with NM but, the legacy was passed down. I wonder if anyone else has had that happen. The N passed down to other family members. I have N mother, N sister, and N oldest Son. So......I don't have anyone. But.......its been a long journey to just get it, and get over it. I can't think of anything else to call it. It does for sure begin and end, with self love and self care. There is nothing else to measure it by. Because to me, their crazy. AND WHEN YOU mess with CRAZY, its Crazy.
Let me know your thoughts everyone.
Baby kay

lynn1234 · Joined: 14 Aug 2007 Posts: 722

Hi baby_kay..

I can relate to you with your N sister.. I am starting to wonder if my sister is also an N too.. I live in a different state and she is in her early 20's so it might be too early to tell and I live too far away to have enough contact with her... However, my sister has definately got a lot of my NM's traits..
My sister rarely returns calls or emails.. Is drinking pretty heavily and I have a hard time admitting or saying it... But I think she is an alcoholic repeating my NM's alcoholism.. I also know my sister smokes pot regularily.. She is getting to be unreliable....My sister isn't a big communicator.. she kind of communicates like a guy would.. She is not big on telling someone what she is "feeling". But having an N mother my NM also never discussed her "feelings" unless ofcorse she was pissed off.....So, sometimes I wonder what my sister is thinking..She is more into doing things with someone then talking like most women do....I have no way to read her...Right now I am just concerned.. I don't want her to turn into my NM.. I have never seen a crazy vendictive manipulative side to her though and she is not arguemntitive either.. so I guess those are all good signs....But I can't understand why she acts like my NM...not returning phone calls or seeming to miss me... It's strange and my sister and I when we are together get along fine....
Anyway... sorry you have an N sister too... I think this N thing unfortunately gets passed down for generations.. I don't know if the cycle ever gets broken.. I don't have any kids right now( not by choice) I haven't been able to get pregnant.... but the more I think about it I get scared that if it did happen would I end up haveing an N child... The more time goes by and my clock ticks I think maybe not haveing a child for me is a good thing... I would have an emotional breakdown if I had a kid like my own mother....and sometimes I fear that I might unentionally or un-knowingly start acting like my NM and damage a kid... even though I would take grate pains not to but I fear that some damaged part of me would come out and damage my own kid...The thought of that freaks me out... Anyway... I give you credit for handeling emotionaly the task of haveing an N child.. I don't know if I could be strong enough .....Good thing you have other children who are loving...

windinthetrees · Joined: 06 Mar 2007 Posts: 133

I agree. Messing with CRAZY makes CRAZY. I have beeb baffled for days about my parents' denial about a fight we had. i am just lost.
There is no getting thru. detaching is the only way. i am just beginning
to detach. my parents call me, that is fine. i no longer call them (2 weeks now) in fact i have delected their number out of my cell, don't have it memorized anyway! Rolling Eyes

windinthetrees · Joined: 06 Mar 2007 Posts: 133

oh, and my dad only calls when he needs to ALARM me about something or when he is injured and needs sympathy. sad.

my mom calls when he is not around, always in the AM, or from her cell , as he never uses it and chastises her for it. she sneaks and